Transcript of External Affairs Minister's Interview with BBC World Television for the 'Asia Today' Programme
on 19.1.2000 by Stephen Cole


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Jaswant Singh: It is not a consequence of the hijacking alone if that is what you mean by linking but it is a Joint Working Group that India and United States have set up to combat the international menace of terrorism because, assumption being, there is indeed such a menace and it needs to be addressed jointly.

Stephen Cole: Did the US, Did Mr. Talbott agree with India's position that Pakistan was directly involved in hijacking?

Jaswant Singh: Well, we discussed it but it was not my expectation that I will want from Strobe Talbott a judgement, one way or another. These are necessarily issues that are considered at some length by various countries from different angles.

Stephen Cole: Now you also said that you talked about nuclear issues.

Jaswant Singh: Yes indeed. The non-proliferation and disarmament issues.

Stephen Cole: Did you tell Mr. Talbott when you would sign the CTBT?

Jaswant Singh: No It is not question of so much of when we will sign. Our position is very clear in this regard. We, in any case continue to observe the voluntary moratorium on any further testing and we have quite explicity stated that the commitment that India has made of converting this voluntary moratorium into a de jure obligation requires that we build within India as wide consensus as we can.

Stephen Cole: With this continuing high level of tension worrying the region so much, have you got any plans to try and reduce that high level tension?

Jaswant Singh: Of course. Because we have demonstrated the steps that we can take. India after all is the initiator of the dialogue and the process of reconciliation, that is what the dramatic and historic bus journey to Lahore was all about. It remains a matter of great regret and disappointment, both to my Prime Minister as also to I personally, that the bus was turned away from Lahore and sent to Kargil.

Stephen Cole: As a result, can India take steps now to try and reduce the level of tension?

Jaswant Singh: We will remain committed to dialogue and reconciliation but it is obvious that for this, not as a pre-condition but as an integral of the dialogue process itself, a proper environment is created.

Stephen Cole: What would that proper environment be?

Jaswant Singh: I think (a) the abjuring of violence (b) I think there would have to be a demonstration of giving up encouragement to cross-border terrorism which needs encouragement by agencies of State and the State itself. And there will also have to be a secession to this daily cry of Jehad against India. Also, the kind of very aggressive propaganda that is carried out on a daily basis. These are not pre-conditions. These are essential integrals for the creation of a proper environment.

Stephen Cole: Pakistan is accusing India of being behind Monday's bomb blast in Karachi. Was India involved at all?

Jaswant Singh: No. I heard of the bomb attack only here through media and I find it completely unexpectable that India in any sense can be involved. It was not an attack, it was a blast or something, yes.

Stephen Cole: Pakistan accuses India of being responsible for whole series of bomb attacks in Pakistan. Is it possible that two countries are conducting a proxy war?

Jaswant Singh: No. I think that Pakistan is certainly conducting a clandestine war, not a proxy war. But so far as India is concerned and certainly since this Government came into office, not last year but in 1998, there is no question of any such kind of activity in Pakistan ever having been encouraged by India.

Stephen Cole: Now you talked earlier about the bus to Lahore being sent back to Kargil. Is India's hostility to Pakistan based on the belief that General Musharraf was in charge of military during last year's fighting?

Jaswant Singh: I think...firstly India has no hostility, as you suggest. In fact for the people of Pakistan, the Government and the people of India have nothing else but the greatest fellow feeling, which is what the bus is all about. It is not hostility. Kargil demonstrated not just a physical aggression by the armed forces of Pakistan, following as it is did upon Lahore. Above all, it demonstrated a transgression upon the territory of trust. The physical aggression was vacated as it invariably would be by any self-respecting nation. How do you regain the territory of trust? It is not hostility, it is an attempt to slowly regain trust between the two countries.

Stephen Cole: Who is going to take the first step towards re-building that trust to put the bus back from Kargil to Lahore?

Jaswant Singh: The bus incidentally continues to ply. It continues to move between Lahore and Delhi on a daily basis. Who is going to take the first step? I do not think it is 'wait for your first step' kind of game.

Stephen Cole: That is the problem, is it not?

Jaswant Singh: No, it is not. Not really. It is quite clear from the evolution of events themselves that certain things have to be done and Pakistan has to recognise that this compulsive hostility that it demonstrates towards India must cease. I do not wish to particularise it and concentrate only on the hijack to Kandhar which is a trial for large numbers of Indians but there is need for Pakistan to come to terms with reality.

Stephen Cole: And the reality being...

Jaswant Singh: The reality being that India really has no hostility towards Pakistan, that Pakistan cannot, can simply not have a position of perpetual confrontation against India. It will cause irreparable damage.

Stephen Cole: Do you have hostility towards General Musharraf ?

Jaswant Singh: Of course not, not in slightest. I scarcely know the gentleman.

Stephen Cole: But would you be prepared to talk to the military regime?

Jaswant Singh: Yes. I would be prepared to talk with a duly elected government of any country.

Stephen Cole: So you would not be prepared to talk to General Musharraf.

Jaswant Singh: I did not say that. There has to be certain degree of democratic legitimacy. This I put above all in this age and day.

Stephen Cole: There is concern because the two countries are declared nuclear powers. Mr. Talbott must have mentioned that to you.

Jaswant Singh: Yes, there is a concern about that, but some of these concerns after all, if it was simply the question of the possession of nuclear weapons, then the manner and the restraint with which India in the face of aggression conducted itself in the challenge of Kargil, ought to set at least some of those doubts at rest. India will carry on, we will continue with what we have to do because it is not just relations with Pakistan that are our concern. To Pakistan, that seems to be the central focus of their entire existence.

Stephen Cole: Let us move to March and the proposed visit by the American President. Did Mr. Talbott confirm that President Clinton would be coming to Delhi.

Jaswant Singh: Well, some more discussions about the visit took place but the dates and details of the visit are yet to be finally announced and we have to work on these details yet.

Stephen Cole: But you are hopeful that President Clinton will come to Delhi in March.

Jaswant Singh: There is a declared intention and an invitation from India, also from Prime Minister that President Clinton is most welcome. The President has expressed great interest in visiting India and we look forward to it.

Philip Hayton, Presenter: That was the Indian Foreign Minister Jaswant Singh talking to Stephen Cole.